Space & Astronomy/Space and Astronomy (October 1993).iso/mac/TEXT/SPACEDIG/V16_5/V16NO518.TXT

Internet Message Format | 1993-07-13 | 30KB

Date: Wed,  5 May 93 05:17:48
From: Space Digest maintainer <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]
Subject: Space Digest V16 #518
To: Space Digest Readers
Precedence: bulk


Space Digest                Wed,  5 May 93       Volume 16 : Issue 518

Today's Topics:
      ASTRONAUTS---What does weightlessness feel like?  (2 msgs)
             HST Servicing Mission Scheduled for 11 Days
                    Mars Observer Job Opportunity
                    Space FAQ 01/15 - Introduction
                         Vandalizing the sky
                         Vandalizing the sky.

    Welcome to the Space Digest!!  Please send your messages to
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----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 03 May 93 16:50:07 GMT
From: George Hastings <[e-mail]>
Subject: ASTRONAUTS---What does weightlessness feel like?
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.astro

Jerry Liebelson ([e-mail] ) writes:
> organ.com
> Nntp-Posting-Host: katana
> Organization: Morgan Stanley - IS
> Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1993 16:15:01 GMT
> Lines: 16
>
>  I want to know what weightlessness actually FEELS like. For example, is
> there a constant sensation of falling? And what is the motion sickness
> that some astronauts occasionally experience?
>  Please reply only if you are either a former or current astronaut, or
> someone who has had this

     I'm not an astronaut, but I did experience weightlessness last summer
onboard a Russian TU-76MDK aircraft during a week of cosmonaut training.
     To ME personally it FELT WONDERFUL! Incredible! Probably
one of the most exciting things I've ever done. The closest I
can come to actually describing the sensation is to ask you to
imagine floating at the edge of a swimmming pool. Now you take
a breath, duck under the water, place your feet against the
side of the pool, stretch your arms out in front of you and
pussh off the side gently to glide underwater, suspended
halfway between the bottom and the surface. Got it?
    Now imagine not having to hold your breath, and remove the
sensations of water pressure, resistance, and feeling the water
flow past your sides as you move. If you can imagine all that,
then you'll come close to the sensation of weightlessness. It
was a feeling of FREEDOM! I had sore cheeks afterward from
grinning so much! 8-)
    My reaction was not shared by all, however. I was lucky.
For training on an aircraft doing parabolic arcs or for
cosmonauts and astronauts in orbit, about half experience
varying degrees of nausea. Your innards are used to being
pulled down by 1-G when you weigh zero, internally everything
tends to float higher inside. Remember the sensation you get on
the first hill on a rollercoaster. On that first drop you are
almost in free-fall and if you could weigh yourself during the
drop, you'd measure only a fraction of your 1-G weight. Now
imagine that just as you start down the hill and your stomach
is floating somewhere perilously close to your tonsils, you
look out in front of you and realize that the hill has no
bottom! The hollow feeling in your stomach will not disappear
in a few seconds. It will go on, and on, and on, and on, ad
nauseum [literally!] 8-). I'd say that you'd throw up, but in
weightlessness there IS no up, so you'd just throw OUT!
...better have a barf-bag hand, since EVERYTHING floats, and if
your chunks ended up in somebody's ear, they'd probably never
talk to you again! <grin!>
   Six of the twelve of us on the training flight put their
breakfasts in bags during the flight, and two more were pretty
distressed, So you ca see that the feeling of weightlessness is
NOT the same for everybody. None of the six Russian cosmonauts
abaord with spaceflight experience got sick.
 ____________________________________________________________
| George Hastings        [e-mail] |
| Space Science Teacher        [e-mail]      |  If it's not
| Mathematics & Science Center     STAREACH BBS: 804-343-6533   |   FUN, it's
| 2304 Hartman Street        OFFICE:       804-343-6525   |  probably not
| Richmond, VA 23223        FAX:          [phone]   |    SCIENCE!
 ------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 03 May 93 17:12:17 GMT
From: George Hastings <[e-mail]>
Subject: ASTRONAUTS---What does weightlessness feel like?
Newsgroups: sci.space

 ([e-mail]) writes:
> Ron:
> : It is the body's reaction to a strange environment.  It appears to be
> : induced partly to physical discomfort and part to mental distress.
> : Some people are more prone to it than others, like some people are more
> : prone to get sick on a roller coaster ride than others.  The mental
> : part is usually induced by a lack of clear indication of which way is
> : up or down, ie: the Shuttle is normally oriented with its cargo bay
> : pointed towards Earth, so the Earth (or ground) is "above" the head of
> : the astronauts.  About 50% of the astronauts experience some form of
> : motion sickness, and NASA has done numerous tests in space to try to
> : see how to keep the number of occurances down.
>
> I'm a volunteer in JSC's Space Biomedical Laboratory where they do,
> among other things, some of the tests Ron mentions.  I was in one
> called the Pre-flight Adaptation Trainer, which consisted of a chair on
> a several-degree-of-freedom motion base with moving geometric visual
> aids.  The goal was to measure the subject's
> responses and subjective physiological descriptions and see if repeated
> exposure to this environment could reduce future motion sickness
> symptoms.

   This is similar to cosmonaut training in Star City, where
trainees undergo "vestibular training". One technique is to put
you in a chair that spins at about on rev/sec. With your eyes
closed, you feel dizzy until the fluid in your ears reaches the
same spin rate. Then a beeper is turned on, one beep per rev,
synchronized with the chair. At the sound of each beep, you
must tip your head as far as you can, first towad the right
shoulder, then toward the left. The coriolis effect of this
movement causes the fluid in your semi-circular canals to swirl
rapidly, first one way, then the opposite.
  My first sensation was extreme dizziness, but very quickly, a
strange sensation manifested itself. With no visual frame of
reference, with continuing head-tipping, it began to produce
the sensation of swinging forward and back! The dizziness
disappeared. That was O.K. for a few more minutes, but as I
continued the head movements and the rotation, it began to feel
at each time I had the sensation of swinging forward I was
turning 180 degrees to the side, until I was upside down. As
the sensation of swinging back began, it felt as though I was
also beginning to roll in the opposite direction, and by the
time I had reached the back of my PERCEIVED swing to the rear,
it felt as though I had rolled the other direction through 360
degrees ending upside down again. It was this perception of
full circle rolls overlaid on the sensation of swinging the
gave me the cold sweats after about six minutes. If the test
had gone on longer, I'm certain that I would have hurled! If I
make th final cut and return to Star City for a year's
training, I'll have to be able to do this for a minimum of ten
minutes without getting sick. When you can handle this one,
they put you on this same rotating chair, and mount the chair
on a swinging platform! GROAN! 8-)
 ____________________________________________________________
| George Hastings               [e-mail] |
| Space Science Teacher        [e-mail]      |  If it's not
| Mathematics & Science Center     STAREACH BBS: 804-343-6533   |   FUN, it's
| 2304 Hartman Street        OFFICE:       804-343-6525   |  probably not
| Richmond, VA 23223        FAX:          [phone]   |    SCIENCE!
 ------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 15:42:29 GMT
From: fred j mccall 575-3539 <[e-mail]>
Subject: HST Servicing Mission Scheduled for 11 Days
Newsgroups: sci.space,sci.space.shuttle,sci.astro

In <1rs0au$[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Pat) writes:

>I just figured, if GOldin wants to really,  prove out faster, cheaper
>better,   have some of the whiz kids  slap together an expendable
>space manuevering tug  out of a BUs1,  and use that for the re-boost.
>it has to be better then using the Discovery as a tow truck.

Well, no, for a lot of the reasons cited.  Contamination risk is less

using the Shuttle OMS system because the Shuttle is a nice big bird
and that distances the source of contamination from the thing you're
worried about (not to mention Shuttle mass blocking it).

I'm curious.  What would be your reaction if they took your advice,
had some whiz kids cobble together something, slapped it on the butt
of the HST, and it screwed up?  I suspect you'd be the first person
calling for lynchings.  I'd rather have the people on the spot to deal
with problems when we're talking about a $1G instrument.

--
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[e-mail] - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 16:33:12 GMT
From: Greg Mehall <[e-mail]>
Subject: Mars Observer Job Opportunity
Newsgroups: sci.space

Mars Observer Job Opportunity

The Department of Geology at Arizona State University is currently looking
for personnel to staff the Mission Operations Center for the Mars Observer
Thermal Emission Spectrometer experiment. This instrument is a Fourier
transform infrared spectrometer, which will be used to determine the
composition of rocks, soils, ices, clouds and atmosphere on Mars.  Launch
of the spacecraft occurred on September 25, 1992, with arrival at Mars
in August of 1993.

Job Description:
Will be responsible for the planning of observations and generation of
instrument commands used to operate the Mars Observer Thermal Emission
Spectrometer (TES) experiment. Will manage the observation database and
participate in validation of data downlinked from Mars. These activities
will be performed on a computer workstation, and will involve extensive use
of mission operations planning software developed at ASU. Science observation
planning will require knowledge and application of complex procedures and
ability to work independently. Knowledge of the Martian surface and
atmosphere is required to plan observations. Will work directly with the
Science Team, and must be capable of translating science objectives and
strategies into actual observation sequences. Will participate in data
analysis and generation of scientific papers.

Qualifications:
Bachelor's degree in natural science (geology, physics, astronomy or
planetary science preferred), plus four years experience in science data
acquisition and/or analysis. Master's degree in natural science desired.
Prior experience and active participation with a research project is
required. Extensive knowledge of UNIX operating system is required and
experience with SUN workstations is highly desired. Prior experience with
spacecraft mission operations, data collection and data analysis is desired.

Position Information:
Anticipated salary is $25,000 to $30,000. Position is funded yearly and
could continue through 06/30/96, with continuation contingent upon NASA
funding. Applications will be accepted between May 1 and June 30, 1993.
Expected hire date will be between August 1 and September 1, 1993.

Unfortunately, we cannot consider Email replies. Please send letter of
application, resume and information for two potential references to:

Arizona State University
Human Resources - Employment
Attn: Mars Observer Research Specialist Senior
Box 871403
Tempe, AZ 85287

------------------------------

Date: 3 May 1993 12:14:04 -0400
From: Jon Leech <[e-mail]>
Subject: Space FAQ 01/15 - Introduction
Newsgroups: sci.astro,sci.space,sci.answers,news.answers

Archive-name: space/intro
Last-modified: $Date: 93/05/03 12:08:04 $

    FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ON SCI.SPACE/SCI.ASTRO

    INTRODUCTION

    This series of linked messages is periodically posted to the Usenet
groups sci.space and sci.astro in an attempt to provide good answers to
frequently asked questions and other reference material which is worth
preserving. If you have corrections or answers to other frequently asked
questions that you would like included in this posting, send email to
[e-mail] (Jon Leech).

    If you don't want to see the FAQ, add 'Frequently Asked Questions' to
your KILL file for this group (if you're not reading this with a newsreader
that can kill articles by subject, you're out of luck).

    The FAQ volume is excessive right now and will hopefully be trimmed down
by rewriting and condensing over time. The FAQ postings are available in
the Ames SPACE archive in FAQ/faq<#>.

    Good summaries will be accepted in place of the answers given here. The
point of this is to circulate existing information, and avoid rehashing old
answers. Better to build on top than start again. Nothing more depressing
than rehashing old topics for the 100th time. References are provided
because they give more complete information than any short generalization.

    Questions fall into three basic types:

    1) Where do I find some information about space?

    Try your local public library first. The net is not a good place to ask
    for general information. Ask INDIVIDUALS (by email) if you must. There
    are other sources, use them, too. The net is a place for open ended
    discussion.

    2) I have an idea which would improve space flight?

    Hope you aren't surprised, but 9,999 out of 10,000 have usually been
    thought of before. Again, contact a direct individual source for
    evaluation. NASA fields thousands of these each day.

    3) Miscellanous queries.

    These are addressed on a case-by-case basis in the following series of
    FAQ postings.


    SUGGESTIONS FOR BETTER NETIQUETTE

    Read news.announce.newusers if you're on Usenet.
    Minimize cross references, [Do you REALLY NEED to?]
    Edit "Subject:" lines, especially if you're taking a tangent.
    Send mail instead, avoid posting follow ups. (1 mail message worth
    100 posts).
    Internet mail readers: send requests to add/drop to SPACE-REQUEST
    not SPACE.
    Read all available articles before posting a follow-up. (Check all
    references.)
    Cut down attributed articles (leave only the points you're
    responding to; remove signatures and headers). Summarize!
    Put a return address in the body (signature) of your message (mail
    or article), state your institution, etc. Don't assume the
    'reply' function of mailers will work.
    Use absolute dates. Post in a timely way. Don't post what everyone
    will get on TV anyway.
    Some editors and window systems do character count line wrapping:
    keep lines under 80 characters for those using ASCII terminals
    (use carriage returns).


    INDEX TO LINKED POSTINGS

    I've attempted to break the postings up into related areas. There isn't
    a keyword index yet; the following lists the major subject areas in each
    posting. Only those containing astronomy-related material are posted to
    sci.astro (indicated by '*' following the posting number).

    #    Contents

    1*    Introduction
        Suggestions for better netiquette
        Index to linked postings
        Notes on addresses, phone numbers, etc.
        Contributors

    2*    Network resources
        Overview
        Mailing lists
        Periodically updated information
        Warning about non-public networks

    3*    Online (and some offline) sources of images, data, etc.
        Introduction
        Viewing Images
        Online Archives
        NASA Ames
        NASA Astrophysics Data System
        NASA Jet Propulsion Lab (Mission Information and Images)
        NASA Langley (Technical Reports)
        NASA Spacelink
        National Space Science Data Center
        Space Telescope Science Institute Electronic Info. Service
        Starcat
        Astronomical Databases
        Astronomy Programs
        Orbital Element Sets
        SPACE Digest
        Landsat & NASA Photos
        Planetary Maps
        Cometary Orbits

    4*    Performing calculations and interpreting data formats
        Computing spacecraft orbits and trajectories
        Computing planetary positions
        Computing crater diameters from Earth-impacting asteroids
        Map projections and spherical trignometry
        Performing N-body simulations efficiently
        Interpreting the FITS image format
        Sky (Unix ephemeris program)
        Three-dimensional star/galaxy coordinates

    5*    References on specific areas
        Publishers of space/astronomy material
        Careers in the space industry
        DC-X single-stage to orbit (SSTO) program
        How to name a star after a person
        LLNL "great exploration"
        Lunar Prospector
        Lunar science and activities
        Orbiting Earth satellite histories
        Spacecraft models
        Rocket propulsion
        Spacecraft design
        Esoteric propulsion schemes (solar sails, lasers, fusion...)
        Spy satellites
        Space shuttle computer systems
        SETI computation (signal processing)
        Amateur satellies & weather satellites
        Tides

    6*    Constants and equations for calculations

    7*    Astronomical Mnemonics

    8    Contacting NASA, ESA, and other space agencies/companies
        NASA Centers / Arianespace / ESA / NASDA / Soyuzkarta / Space
        Camp / Space Commerce Corporation / Spacehab / SPOT Image
        Other commercial space businesses

    9    Space shuttle answers, launch schedules, TV coverage
        Shuttle launchings and landings; schedules and how to see them
        Why does the shuttle roll just after liftoff?
        How to receive the NASA TV channel, NASA SELECT
        Amateur radio frequencies for shuttle missions
        Solid Rocket Booster fuel composition

    10    Planetary probes - Historical Missions
        US planetary missions
        Mariner (Venus, Mars, & Mercury flybys and orbiters)
        Pioneer (Moon, Sun, Venus, Jupiter, and Saturn flybys and orbiters)
        Ranger (Lunar lander and impact missions)
        Lunar Orbiter (Lunar surface photography)
        Surveyor (Lunar soft landers)
        Viking (Mars orbiters and landers)
        Voyager (Outer planet flybys)
        Soviet planetary missions
        Soviet Lunar probes
        Soviet Venus probes
        Soviet Mars probes
        Japanese planetary missions
        Planetary mission references

    11    Upcoming planetary probes - missions and schedules
        Cassini
        Galileo
        Magellan
        Mars Observer
        TOPEX/Poseidon
        Ulysses
        Other space science missions
        Proposed missions

    12    Controversial questions
        What happened to the Saturn V plans
        Why data from space missions isn't immediately available
        Risks of nuclear (RTG) power sources for space probes
        Impact of the space shuttle on the ozone layer
        How long can a human live unprotected in space
        How the Challenger astronauts died
        Using the shuttle beyond Low Earth Orbit
        The "Face on Mars"

    13    Space activist/interest/research groups and space publications
        Groups
        Publications
        Undocumented Groups

    14    How to become an astronaut

    15    Orbital and Planetary Launch Services


    NOTES ON ADDRESSES, PHONE NUMBERS, ETC.

    Unless otherwise specified, telephone numbers, addresses, and so on are
    for the United States of America. Non-US readers should remember to add
    the country code for telephone calls, etc.


    CREDITS

    Eugene Miya started a series of linked FAQ postings some years ago which
    inspired (and was largely absorbed into) this set.

    Peter Yee and Ron Baalke have and continue to spend a lot of their own
    time setting up the SPACE archives at NASA Ames and forwarding official
    NASA announcements.

    Many other people have contributed material to this list in the form of
    old postings to sci.space and sci.astro which I've edited. Please let me
    know if corrections need to be made. Contributors I've managed to keep
    track of are:

    [e-mail] (Francis Reddy)    - map projections
    [e-mail] (Steven Fisk)        - publication refs.
    [e-mail] (Richard Akerman)   - crater diameters
    [e-mail] (Lisa Weigel)    - SEDS info
    [e-mail] (Srinivas Bettadpur) - tides
    [e-mail] (Alan Wm Paeth) - map projections
    [e-mail] (Allen W. Sherzer)        - Great Exploration
    [e-mail] (Ron Baalke)    - planetary probe schedules
    [e-mail] (Timothy Banks)    - map projections,
    variable star analysis archive
    [e-mail] (Jochen Bern)        - German mnemonic translation
    [e-mail] (Bernie Rosen)    - Space Camp
    [e-mail] (Barry Schlesinger)   - FITS format
    [e-mail] (Craig E. Ward)        - space group contact info
    [e-mail] (Tom Chapin)        - planetary positions
    [e-mail] (D. Alan Cunningham)    - NASA Spacelink
    [e-mail] (Cliff Yamamoto) - orbital elements
    [e-mail] (Anthony Datri)        - PDS/VICAR viewing software
    [e-mail] (Dave Rickel)        - orbit formulae
    [e-mail] (Phil Fraering)        - propulsion
    [e-mail] (Dani Eder)        - Saturn V plans, SRBs
    [e-mail] (Eugene N. Miya)    - introduction,
    NASA contact info, started FAQ postings
    [e-mail] (Patrick M. French)    - space group contact info
    [e-mail] (Gary Morris)        - amateur radio info
    [e-mail] (Terry Gaetz)        - N-body calculations,
    orbital dynamics
    [e-mail] (Steve Grandi)        - planetary positions
    [e-mail] (Dale M. Greer)   - constants
    [e-mail] (Henry Spencer)    - survival in vacuum,
    astronaut how-to, Challenger disaster, publication refs, DC-X
    [e-mail] (William Higgins)    - RTGs, publishers,
    shuttle landings, spysats, propulsion, "Face on Mars"
    [e-mail] (Hal Mueller)    - map projections,
    orbital dynamics
    [e-mail] (Josh Hopkins)    - launch services
    [e-mail] (Jim Bowery)        - propulsion, launch services
    [e-mail] (James N. Head) - atmospheric scale heights
    [e-mail] (Jim Scotti)    - planetary positions
    [e-mail] (Kieran A. Carroll)- refs for spacecraft design
    [e-mail] (Kenneth Ng)        - RTGs
    [e-mail] (Ken Jenks)    - shuttle roll manuever
    [e-mail] (Larry Klaes)    - planetary probe history
    [e-mail] (Jon Leech)        - crater diameters
    [e-mail] (Lou Adornato)            - orbital dynamics
    [e-mail] (Maury Markowitz)   - propulsion
    [e-mail] (Erik Max Francis)    - equations
    [e-mail]        - N-body calculations
    [e-mail] (Marc Wayne Mcconley)    - space careers
    [e-mail] (Mark Brader)            - Mariner 1 info.
    [e-mail] (Mark Maimone)            - SPACE Digest
    [e-mail] (Dr. Nick Watkins)    - models, spysats
    [e-mail] (Olivier R. Hainaut)    - publishers, STARCAT
    [e-mail] (Graham O'Neil)    - Lunar Prospector
    [e-mail] (Kenneth W Durham)    - cometary orbits, IAU
    [e-mail] (Paul Blase)    - propulsion
    [e-mail] (Pete Banholzer)    - Clementine
    [e-mail] (Peter Scott)    - RTGs
    [e-mail] (Paul W. Schleck)    - AMSAT, ARRL contact info
    [e-mail] (Rodney Brown)        - propulsion refs
    [e-mail] (Ran Atkinson)    - FTPable astro. programs
    [e-mail] (R. Michael Jungclas)- models
    [e-mail] (Curt Roelle)    - German mnemonic translation
    [e-mail] (David Seal)    - Cassini mission schedule
    [e-mail] (Mary Shafer)    - photos, shuttle landings
    [e-mail] (Willie Smith)    - photos
    [e-mail] (Stephen Dixon)    - shuttle audio frequencies
    [e-mail] (Ray Sterner)    - planetary positions
    [e-mail] (Phil Stooke)    - planetary maps
    [e-mail] (Ted Anderson)    - propulsion
    [e-mail] (Terry Hancock)    - NASA center info
    [e-mail] (Bill Thorson) - FITS info
    [e-mail] (Todd L. Masco)    - SPACE Digest
    [e-mail] (Tom Horsley)    - refs for algorithms
    [e-mail] (Veikko Makela)    - orbital element sets
    [e-mail] (Wales Larrison) - groups & publications
    [e-mail] (Wayne Hayes)    - constants
    [e-mail] (Matthew P Wiener) - Voyager history
    [e-mail] (Yoshiro Yamada)    - ISAS/NASDA missions
    [e-mail] (Peter Yee)        - AMES archive server,
    propulsion

    In Net memoriam:
    Ted Flinn

NEXT: FAQ #2/15 - Network Resources

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 16:00:00 GMT
From: fred j mccall 575-3539 <[e-mail]>
Subject: Vandalizing the sky
Newsgroups: sci.space

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Tom) writes:

>I would guess that the best legal and moral basis for protest would
>be violation of private property.  "I bought this house, out in
>the boondocks, specifically to enjoy my hobby, amateur astronomy.  Now
>this billboard has made that investment worthless, so I want the
>price of the property, in damages."  It wouldn't take too many
>succesful cases like that to make bill-sats prohibitively expensive.

Except for one small detail:  I thought it had already been
established that this would interfere minimally, if at all, with even
*professional* astronomers, much less with amateurs.  Damned difficult
to win a case where you can't demonstrate damages, and I don't think
complaining that your sky has been 'besmirched by vile mankind' is
going to get you real far.

--
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[e-mail] - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 3 May 1993 15:57:38 GMT
From: fred j mccall 575-3539 <[e-mail]>
Subject: Vandalizing the sky.
Newsgroups: sci.astro,sci.space

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:

>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (fred j mccall 575-3539) writes:
>> In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (George F. Krumins) writes:
>>
>>>I was suggesting that the minority of professional and amateur astronomers
>>>have the right to a dark, uncluttered night sky.
>>
>> And from whence does this right stem, that it overrides the 'rights'
>> of the rest of us?
>>
> Let me get this right - sorry, try again.  Let me get this straight -
>well maybe that too is a poor choice of words - someone might think
>I'm pushing a gay agenda.  How about:  let me try to understand this
>by re-phrasing it as an extreme.  I, as a minority of one, have no right
>to a beautiful world.  You, on the other hand have the right to make an
>ugly one because you presume to speak for all the rest.  And I cannot
>complain.  Curious.

Yes, a nice "re-phrasing it as an extreme".  Pleased that you don't
let little things like what I actually said stand in the way of
'proving' your position via claiming things that I never said.  Most
curious, indeed.  If you wish to maintain your pristine sky, I suggest
you come up with economically viable ways to replace the funding you
would prohibit them from acquiring for this mission by doing the
advertising.  Otherwise, you should get out of the way, because Adam
Smith's dead hand is likely to strangle you, otherwise.

>..

>>>I say:
>>>What I'm objecting to here is a floating billboard that, presumably,
>>>would move around in the sky.  I, for one, am against legislating
>>>at all.  I just wish that people had a bit of common courtesy, and
>>>would consider how their greed for money impacts the more ethereal and
>>>aesthetic values that make us human.  This includes the need for wild
>>>and unspoiled things, including the night sky.
>>
>> Oh, I see.  You don't want any legislation that might impinge on you;
>> you just want everyone else on the planet to do what you want.
>>

>And do you want everyone to do as you wish (insist on putting something
>up that will impact everyone for selfish reasons) _without_ any legislation?
>And no one else can even object?

Object as you like.  Do as you like.  But if you think that a minority
'right' that doesn't exist should be allowed to stand in the way of
research just because you don't like the idea that part of it is being
funded by 'grubby commercialism', then I would suggest that you come
up with better solutions for where to get the money from.  I'm sure
they'd be more than happy to listen to you, if you should come up with
something workable.

>Somehow I think this whole shoving
>contest has gotten way off the track.  I'm ready to let this thread
>die a quick and merciful death.

No doubt you are, after trying to have the last word on it.  If you're
ready to let it die, why did you even write a note?

--
"Insisting on perfect safety is for people who don't have the balls to live
 in the real world."   -- Mary Shafer, NASA Ames Dryden
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[e-mail] - I don't speak for others and they don't speak for me.

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End of Space Digest Volume 16 : Issue 518
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